SPEAKER_02 0:00

Anything is possible in Morrisons. It's very special like that. If you if you have the ambition, you'll be provided the opportunity. And then if you go for that opportunity, then more opportunities will follow.

SPEAKER_00 0:16

Welcome to the Talent Download podcast. I'm Darren Lancaster. I'm CEO of Amberjack. It's an absolute delight to have a really special guest on today's podcast. It's been a really interesting journey for her and the organisation that she's been a part of. So I'd like to welcome today Ali Guest. She is the senior people lead at Morrison's. As I suggested, we're going to talk through everything early careers today and really get a deep understanding, I guess, of the journey and the journey that you've had out of in the space. Obviously, lots of different experiences that you've had across your background and careers, which will also be great to come to light. So and maybe that's uh a really kind of good place to start. So let's dive, I guess, a little bit into you and understanding a little bit about you and the detail, and also I guess some information, I guess, for the listeners really regarding kind of Morrison's journey.

SPEAKER_02 1:15

Okay, um, so me, I mean, my uh my background has always been in HR pretty much. Um but predominantly it's been in banking. Um, but the the part that I loved about banking actually was that more of the retail part of banking. Um so I reached a point in my career where I wanted to make a change and was very lucky after a few knocks on the door, they eventually let me into Morrison's. Um and I wanted to join Morrison's because it's a retailer, it's it's it is what Morrison's is what you think it is. It is a Yorkshire brand. We are down to earth, hardworking, kind of call as fade as fate, um, but also um truly invested uh in talent and in young people.

SPEAKER_00 2:05

Good. And just in terms of the difference, I guess, between working in banking and then working in retail, I imagine that would be quite a big difference. So it's just people to understand that you know.

SPEAKER_02 2:15

It's very different. And uh look, you know, I've learned many things from from both sectors. Um it's it's very different. The difference in uh retail to banking is the how close proximity you are to the executive, actually. Um whereas, you know, uh would I do work, I do a similar job actually, apart from the early careers part, I do a similar job on talent management that I did for Lloyd's Banking Group. Um, but I wouldn't have access to the executive and and some of the more strategic decisions. Whereas in uh retail, retail is very flat, and you do uh it also the amount of teamwork that you have, kind of personal relationship teamwork, um, is greater, I think, in retail than it is in banking. But both have taught me tremendous amounts.

SPEAKER_00 3:10

Yeah, and and working in Lloyd's banking group, I mean that's that's quite a sizable organization, I guess, with lots of different um strains. Your your career, was it always within early careers that you were working within them?

SPEAKER_02 3:21

Uh no, I mean the early careers um only came in Morrison's, actually.

SPEAKER_01 3:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 3:27

Uh so I worked in talent management as again, similar job to what I do now, which is kind of um kind of looking at mainly the top kind of 180, so the directors and their heads off and running the executive talent reviews, etc. But I didn't do early careers uh until I joined um Morrison's. Um, and that was because I joined Morrison's. We had a relatively new CEO who was passionate about early careers and knew that we could do better. Um and so he asked me to kind of lift up the bonnet, see what was happening in terms of our schemes. And then with him and actually our group HR director at the time, Claire Granger, uh, we designed what we wanted the future to look like uh way back in 2017.

SPEAKER_00 4:15

So that was almost the start, was it, for early careers for Morrisons, was it in 2017, or uh or was it happening before then?

SPEAKER_02 4:21

No, it was happening before, and you were supporting us before. Um, but I don't think we put our full force behind it, really. We had when I did lift up the bonnet, we found various things. So, yeah, we found that uh we didn't have the amount of schemes that we have now, so we weren't uh properly fulfilling what we needed from a succession point of view. Uh schemes varied in lengths from 12 months to 18 months to two years, uh, and the kind of development around schemes, um, yeah, it just wasn't quite what it needed to be.

SPEAKER_00 4:57

Yeah, sure. And I guess I guess if we kind of uh rewind a little bit, did when did when did the strategy um really start to take shape? Was it kind of at that point when you joined? Because I know you've you've you've also Morrison's has has had sort of some change. I mean you've been through a lot. You've kind of as all of us we all had COVID, but I always remember that you know supermarkets particularly, they they were the thing that needed everyone to be part of. And then I I appreciate that you've also had some changes kind of from CEO uh on top of that changes. But but did the strategy sort of did it sort of begin to take shape then really when you joined? Yeah, it did.

SPEAKER_02 5:38

That's so I I joined in July, uh July 4th, 2016, um, and pretty much straight after that, the CEO uh and uh and the group HR director was saying, okay, let's let's do something with our schemes.

SPEAKER_01 5:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:54

Um with the kind of strap line that David Potts had, which was let's be spoilt for choice for talent and let's put ourselves into that position. Um and the strategy was put together, you know, it was shared, uh it was shared with the board, it was shared with the leadership team, uh, and the leadership team were kind of corralled around it. Um, and that strategy is absolutely wonderful to kind of with 2025, you know, to kind of see that strategy come to life and the legacy that it's built us. I think for me as well, one of the most important things is you know, early careers is it's part of Morrison's DNA. Everyone gets it, um, everyone sees it as their responsibility, regardless where you are, you know, in the line, um, to mentor, to nurture, to provide the right experience, um, to you know, uh attend assessment centres in person uh and interviews, etc. Uh, and it very much is like I can't see it ever changing from that. And we're very fortunate that we've got our new uh CEO, um Rami uh Betty, uh, he's just as focused on Annie Crits because you never know, right? And we were like, oh, you know, because it's a huge investment that we've continued to do since 2017 and through COVID, so we never faltered uh all the way along. Uh but no, Rami's just as excited um about early talent and nurturing that.

SPEAKER_00 7:27

Yeah, it's great when it's it comes from sort of on top all the way through the organization, but it almost sounds like culturally you've always had it, you you've had it there. I guess you had that belief within the people. Did you face initial challenges though? Was it was there challenges around that or any challenges that you kind of faced at the beginning?

SPEAKER_02 7:45

Um, yeah, of course, there's all there's always challenges, isn't there? I think um, well, if you think about what in 2017, um we also introduced degree apprenticeships. Now we had run some what we called sponsored degrees, where basically uh schemes, not very many, um not that many years, but we had run them with Bradford University, and we'd essentially we just pay for the degree. So it's a similar situation, just not levy funded. Um, but in 2017 we absolutely went for it, and we've kept degree apprenticeships and graduates kind of number wise, a pretty similar year on year. Um, I think uh that was quite difficult for the company to adapt to in terms of what is a degree apprentice and how is a degree apprentice different to a graduate? Well, of course they are, you know, one's 21 something and the other one's like 18. Um, and the concept of you know, levy funding and the fact that you needed 20% off the job, I think I think that was difficult to get that right and for people to understand it. I think they do now, but I think back then they didn't, you know, what is a degree apprenticeship.

SPEAKER_01 9:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:02

Um I think as well, um the other challenges that we've had have been in sites and stores where if you think about in head office as, you know, there's about, I don't know, 2,000 some people in head office. You and you know, it is one head office. I always kind of see it, it's almost like our head office is a bit like we call it the centre, not head office. It's it's a bit like a small village. Yeah, that's what it reminds me of. It's it's very personable. Um, and you can put your arms around your early careers colleagues within that small village. Then obviously, when you get to our sites and stores, then it's much more disparate. You know, we've got yeah, over 500 stores. So making sure that um, you know, uh Alice Ryan uh in a store in Burrowbridge is is really well looked after, yeah, that is that is much more of a challenge. Um, and you know, you've got to then get 500 and so store managers to understand it and understand the scheme and understand the part they play in that. Um have we got it to that now? Yeah, we have. Yeah, we absolutely we have. Um, but that's the bit that's taken a little time.

SPEAKER_00 10:15

Yeah, sure. And and but there's challenges, isn't there, sometimes, but then there's there's kind of also the operational kind of challenges of uh of running running stores and and then having people around it. Was it was there things that needed to be implemented, I guess, to make it a success or things that you had to do and that helped?

SPEAKER_02 10:34

Yeah, of course. I think it's being, I mean, retail is a day-in, day out business. It is it is fast paced, you've got to move with what's going on at the time, what's going on with your customers at the time. Um, and amongst that, sometimes I think it can be hard to then follow a scheme as such. Um, so actually um getting the discipline in about what these young people should be doing, which is going to get them ultimately get them ready to be a store manager in the future, because that's the aim. Yeah, of course. Um, I think that getting that discipline in took a lot more work um and probably a bit more resource from a central point of view, so that you are kind of day in, day out tracking the progress of these young people and talking to store managers and regional managers, of course.

SPEAKER_00 11:26

And and when you look back on it, what what do you think were the big um big things that you implemented that really made that difference, I guess, to make that success happen?

SPEAKER_02 11:36

Um in stores, well, you mean in general?

SPEAKER_00 11:38

Just in general, probably.

SPEAKER_02 11:41

Um without any shadow of any doubt, it's about your CEO, your uh executive, your leadership team being truly, truly behind. That this behind it, that this is a talent strategy and this is important for the company. These are where our future leaders are gonna come from, you know, and and to absolutely believe in that, not that's not a cheesy line. And I think that's what we managed to do from the start, and and that's what made the difference. Um, you know, we had our directors, you know, were were in assessment centres that were assessing. It was brilliant, yeah, absolutely brilliant. Um, and yeah, and it's nothing like actually being there at someone's assessment centre who you hire, who you then see come through a scheme, and then of course, for us, it's you know, the end of the scheme is a start, that's the beginning of their career and progression in the company. It's nothing like somebody seeing that, and because everyone was involved, um, they became very engaged in it and passionate about it personally.

SPEAKER_00 12:52

That's good. And uh, I th from what I read and what I see from the outside, Morrison's really kind of good at kind of really seeing the diff well what impact can really make a difference, I guess, ultimately, and to the organisations, and I guess kind of monitoring that data and thinking that through. And can you share any, I guess, big success stories that you've had?

SPEAKER_02 13:14

You know, what what are you trying to achieve in the end? Because, and I think it's really important for any early careers scheme to stay true to this. So, what early careers colleagues should not be is um someone that's that's gonna pick up your admin or fill in a space here and there. It's very it's very easy actually to kind of follow that route. But what you've got to do is provide them with the right experience because ultimately, in the end, in the end, you want them to be directors in the future. So um, you know, 13% of our directors uh in the company are early careers alumni. And then if you um and and you know, and some of some of those were uh made directors uh at 30 years old, yeah, and and ultimately, now not everyone wants to be a director, and that's okay, right? But ultimately what what we do is we kind of monitor, yeah, pretty much month in, month out, you know, how are these young people progressing and make sure that we've got other opportunities for talent progression that can kind of get them there to fulfil their potential. So I think that's a something that Morrisons are really proud of, and it's such a significant talent pipeline for us. Um, but I think if if you look across like all of our management positions, I think we're at well, I know because I I looked at it um before I had this conversation. Yeah, we're about 9% uh our graduate uh our early careers or early careers alumni, so that that's a fairly significant part.

SPEAKER_01 14:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:59

Um and yeah, it's fabulous to see, but I mean it also is just as fabulous to see, you know, a degree apprentice at 21 years of age running a store. Yeah, I've had the pleasure of seeing that. It's it's incredible, or 23-year-old running a whole manufacturing site. Um we've just got countless stories like that.

SPEAKER_00 15:22

Oh, it's good to see the success of someone. It's interesting what you you talked about there in terms of the way in which you've structured um, I guess, the the overall entry, the the performance of work, and the way that individual um you you can you can see what success looks like, you can kind of demonstrate um that to uh potentially at applying candidates uh for the role, which is fantastic, that being able to show, you know, this is your career path, you know, this is what you can be. But to achieve those types of things, as you say, at the the ages of 23 uh and 21, you know, is fantastic. And yeah, every it sounds sounds great that you can see that success. Um did you when you um I guess sort of set about this this journey, were there objectives that you wanted to see achieved? Was it you know those types of things, you know, target the 29-year-old, I guess, to be a director or other things?

SPEAKER_02 16:18

Um I mean it's interesting because I you know again I'm I'm aware of uh I'm aware of the although I wasn't involved in it, I was aware of Lloyd's Banking Group kind of set a number in terms of how much of their kind of leadship population they wanted to be early careers alumni and by what time. Um I David Potts was never a fan of a metric like that. So uh did we talk about it? Yes, we did, but we didn't go right, it's 10%, it's 15%. We didn't actually do that, um, if I'm honest. Um, but you know, was that ultimately the aim to have a a succession pipeline through to our leadership team? Yeah, I mean, definitely.

SPEAKER_00 17:05

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And did you do capture, have you captured stories, I guess, of individuals? Um, and maybe it'd be good to hear about that, an individual story or or some some kind of success journey someone's had.

SPEAKER_02 17:19

Oh, right. I'll just tell a few stories. Yeah, but I'm not here to do that. Yeah, some some of them might resonate and and some of them won't. Um I suppose for if you look at a key part of what Morrison's does is uh is buy and sell in the end, right? It's fairly it's fairly straightforward. I think everyone can kind of get their head around that. So the the buying part is is oh so critical, you know, and our um commercial function is a fairly large function. So we've seen a number of successes. I'm trying to think how many of our directors have been category, um, early careers have been category directors. I'm gonna say six. Um it is entirely possible. Yeah, it's um anything is possible in Morrison's. It's very special like that. If you if you have the ambition, you will be provided the opportunity, and then if you go for that opportunity, then more opportunities will follow.

SPEAKER_00 18:24

Yeah. It almost could be a strap line, I think, in in many ways, but what what a way, I guess, to understanding that from a candidate's I guess perspective of of when they're making that application and making that that uh a story um must be so important, I think, because you know there can be schemes that you can not eventually kind of get to that point ultimately around it. And it it must help with retention and performance of an individual. You must see that come through.

SPEAKER_02 18:52

It does. I mean, I I you know, I knew you were going to talk to me about retention. Um retention is something that we constantly, constantly look at, and I do mean month in, month out. Um we are we're just below what the national average is on retention for graduates. Uh am I just above or just below? I'm slightly better than the national average, right? For graduates and for degree apprentices. Um I think uh retention is 56% nationally, and I'm I'm I'm slightly better than that. I'm just over the 50 mark. But is it is it a hard one? Yes, it is. Yeah, you you've got to really keep working at that, yeah. And young people are looking for progression, they're looking for development, uh, they're looking for um you know financially to be rewarded. Um so we work constantly on that. I think it it helps because my role is early careers, but it's also talent. So basically, I keep with them through that entire journey, and that's not just me, obviously. I don't kind of rule the world on talent, you know, that talent is in again the DNA of you know, all the people team, but also part of the business. Um, and we constantly at our talent reviews, we constantly look at alumni, uh, we absolutely do, you know. Uh where are they? Have they got the right opportunities? What can they be doing next? Uh, and that's all in the spirit of hoping to retain them with us. But it it's it's tough, and I think I think I'd like to say it myself, I think people know that Morrisons do give good experience uh while you're on scheme, and so you know they're incredibly marketable. I wouldn't say complete scheme, incredibly marketable. Um, so that's that's a constant, a constant challenge. Having said all of that, you're never gonna keep everyone. Yeah, and uh what I say to people if they come and say goodbye is you know, you kind of go look yourself in the mirror, not just me personally, but as a company, and go, did we do the right thing by that person? Did we give them a great opportunity? Have they felt looked after and nurtured, etc.? And if you've done all of that and they choose to go and live in London uh or wherever they decide to do, um, then you know they should go with our well wishes. And we actually have got some success of people leaving and then coming back to us.

SPEAKER_00 21:36

Oh, it's good. Always being more in effective, always the best as well. But I think if every program um that I've seen that's been successful has always um has had to adapt, I guess, to changes. Is is that the same within Morrison's? Have you had to kind of adapt and make changes within the program um at stages? And and sometimes I mean sometimes that can come even from CEO changes, you know, ultimately that those types of things are quite big things and changes for organizations that can affect programs.

SPEAKER_02 22:11

So we've adapted in as much as you know some of our schemes have adapted, i.e., we've got new schemes that we'd never had before. You know, we've got a data science scheme. I don't think that's entirely what you're asking me. I'll come to that. Um, that we wouldn't have had before. Um for all the right reasons. Like there's no surprises on that. Um, I think we've had to adapt in terms of the type of experience that we're giving people. Um, so in you know, if if I go to commercial again, it's like, you know, how do we get it right so that we've they've got the right amount of negotiation skills development and training at the right time to make them successful? How do we make sure that they've got the right categories or they're working in the right categories to get them that successful? Um, and I think in retail, as I've said before, and in our manufacturing logistics schemes, yeah, how do you get the move the different parts of that scheme so that they have the right amount of leadership and managerial experience at the right time? So, and then of course, you know, we we had COVID, um, which was a very, you know, uh interesting time for Morrison's time where we needed to absolutely do the right thing by customers. Um we certainly didn't kind of sabotage all schemes and say just get out to our stores. We we we didn't do that, but we did expect um our early careers colleagues, like anyone else in the business, you know, including me, to do the right thing via customer. So, you know, uh our our early careers colleagues, you know, did go to our logistics sites, you know, for a week or two and just help out because it we were in crisis. But then we got them back to doing what they should be doing, you know, we made sure that we that didn't go over the top, so it was taking away too much of that experience. But I think they learned a a lot from that as well.

SPEAKER_00 24:24

It's a fascinating time, I think, it in terms of retail, particularly the supermarkets, because you you'd had to stay open uh during that period, you know, that probably the most amount of pressure apart from the NHS, yeah, you know, was basically on retail, yeah, and particularly in in in that area. So it's it's good to hear that kind of adaption around early careers and what what people were expected to do and what had to uh happen. You you spoke um you spoke about sort of some of the I I guess the lines of work sort of slightly changing from a digital um perspective, just around digital world. Has has there been much adaption sort of within Morrison's around um what what area of focus you kind of take that journey down in terms of early careers around different places, or is it main pretty consistent around it? Because the the world of work in which we we work um has has changed and adapted and in in many ways. Um I give I give my example of my son. My son's doing a placement year at the moment, and he's doing it um in the city of London. You know, there's an expectation from uh his employer that he does come in five days a week, you know, he is expected, you know, to be in that office from 9 till 5.30. Within retail, that's just you know, ultimately the norm very much that that is the expectation, none of this kind of hybrid work, you know, flexible work. And I don't know that can be different within the corporate office or different areas regarding that, but the majority of the workfalls are kind of in the operational delivery um part as well, uh, around it. But is it has there been much adaption, you know, ultimately that you've seen uh within the business?

SPEAKER_02 26:10

Um in terms of uh ways of working, yeah, we are a we are a very kind of present business. I think um so if you're in our um manufacturing districts stores, obviously um you're in those stores or those sites. Um we have got um some hybrid working um in the centre, um and our graduates and degree apprentices, you know, can work from home um a day or two days. Um although to be absolutely honest, we encouraged them to come into the office so that they can learn from people around them. And the most difficult part of COVID for me was when I mean the office went from uh you know having 2,000 people in it to 500, and there was a prioritization on that. Uh and at first the graduates and degree apprentices were working from home. Um now I was literally begging for them to come back into the office because you know to to arrive and to start to learn a new job and then to try and do that working remotely is incredibly difficult. Um, and and we did get there, yeah, we did prioritize them actually. Um so yes, of course, you know, we we do have some hybrid means of working, but we are fairly present.

SPEAKER_00 27:31

And looking looking ahead for the program and and the ways of working within Morrisons, what do you what do you see the future looking like?

SPEAKER_02 27:41

I there's I mean you've probably you have kind of worked out really that there's been quite a lot of continuity actually in our schemes, which is not uh that's not to say we don't tweak and adjust and all the rest of it. It ch is not a bad thing because it um it breeds that kind of succession pipeline that we've talked about. Um but I think moving forwards, um, what would I like to see? I'd I'd like to see um more around data science, and not just data science, actually um uh data uh analysis. I think you know the company could very much benefit from that. Um we are we used to be kind of stores, you know, supermarket stores. Well now convenience is huge, you know, with over a thousand convenience stores. They might be our own or they might be franchised, but they've got Morrisons above the door. So that's an incredibly important part of our business. Um, and as part of it, we've actually got a a new convenience um uh graduate scheme uh that uh we're putting into action now uh or for the forthcoming year. I I'd like to see that grow, and I'd in some ways I'd like to see that amalgamate with our retail schemes as well, and I think I think they will, you know, because convenience um is different actually to main stores, but it's it's a wonderful place to kind of start your store knowledge. So I think you could expect to see more of that.

SPEAKER_00 29:17

Yeah. And then in you you can't go anywhere without the conversation regarding AI um within um the lives in which we we live every day, um but certainly you know within within our space around um early careers of general recruitment in terms of the adaptions and changes. Is Morrisons uh doing any of those kind of adaptions or changes, or how are you seeing AI, I guess, in the future?

SPEAKER_02 29:45

Yeah, tell me what you um because AI can mean loads of things. So tell me tell me what's in you, what you're thinking.

SPEAKER_00 29:52

Yeah, sure. So um if I give an example, you know, around Amberjack, I guess, around some of the things that we've we've introduced within our within our process. So we've introduced um chatbots within the recruitment process, um, which allows really uh instant access for a candidate anytime to kind of communicate, which is not always easy, you know, ultimately, because a lot of applications are generally happening outs out of kind of out of office hours and things, and that's been a good uh good adoption uh of use of the technology. Um I think there's um we're a big topic at the moment is AI in screening in terms of candidates. We've we've got a massive increase in in applications uh going on at the moment. Um I was just speaking um to one of the accountancy firms the other day, and they were saying just just compared to last year, they're seeing a double doubling of applications, you know, around it. I think yeah, um I think Morrisons are seeing seeing an increase of applications, but also quality um of applications around it. So there's kind of different areas. There's there's there's candidates that are utilising AI, there's um employers or or providers that are supporting those employers um providing AI and I uh um uh or AI solutions to help through that applications. So I I see a lot of the benefits, and I know there's sometimes some fear uh around it, but I guess I guess your perspective of of what you you think and would be great.

SPEAKER_02 31:24

No, I do have a perspective. I think um so it's not necessarily AI, but we'll come on to that. I think so. During COVID, we obviously well Amber Jack were incredible actually, helping us to respond to that and to move from uh what was face-to-face assessment centres into uh obviously doing that digitally. Um, and we've we've kept that. Yeah um and it is in my opinion it's the right way to go because I think most candidates expect it, so they don't expect to have to travel uh here, there, and everywhere for their assessment centre. They expect that they can do that uh uh sat at home or in their student accommodation. Um not everyone, I will come on to AI in a moment. Not everyone likes that, by the way. Um and we often get pushback about well, I'd rather see them voice to vote. We kind of mitigate that by a we have a final interview, which is um uh, but still it's it's it's not too not everyone in the business likes it that way. However, we have to think about well, what we're trying to attract here, we're trying to attract the candidate, and we know all the stats will tell you that the candidate will prefer that virtually. Um so we've responded to that. Um, and Amberjack have helped us tremendously with that, and now couldn't imagine doing it any other way, you know. Um uh it also means that you can, you know, you run four or five assessment centres on the same day. Uh and we do, we are doing. Um I think you know the next step on that is also what what AI can give us, yeah, in terms of in terms of screening, as you say. Um and definitely in terms of I love what you talked about there, and definitely in terms of support of candidates when they're applying. I think that's a very stressful time, actually. You're in your, let's say, it doesn't matter if you're a graduate or if you're you know in year 13, you know, you're studying some very significant uh exams those years, um, and at the same time applying for a job and having to apply to multiple companies for a job. So I think the service that Amberjack can help us support on that is very important. And remember that these people are our customers or their, you know, their family are our customers. So anything that we can utilize around AI, we should. Of course, then there's the other part of AI where you see somebody's um presentation and it's been beautifully written by Chat GPT, um, which I use day in, day out. I I can't imagine not using Chat GPT. Um, so we have got to find ways as well, uh, equally, where we're making sure that it is authentic, what the candidate is giving us, you know. So I think AI needs to work on in both ways.

SPEAKER_00 34:30

Yeah, and I I I think from uh that speaking from an Amberjack um perspective, I think the introduction of AI screening is um super useful to dealing with high high volumes of applications to come through if it's done in the right way, and you this all around the controls um and checks that you actually put put in there, which is important. And and I think the you know the future will look at um the ways in which organizations actually can analyse a candidate's ability to use some of the AI tools um and actually how do they use them? You talked there about you know your use of Chat GPT every day in terms of your your daily record. I think you know the future looks like. Um, how do we actually analyze that? How can we actually score against that and actually see you know how good candidates are uh around the future? So I I I think the benefits of of it, you know, vastly you know, outnumber the the concerns that you can potentially have around it, but it's can it's always about control for me and control and the ways in which you use it and you know it's um it's testing, it's it's making sure that you know the quality assurance is there, you know, for for us in in anything that you do.

SPEAKER_02 35:42

Yeah, I mean candidate experience as well is really important. And uh goes back a few years, but uh I know somebody who uh who applied to a big organization that was clearly using AI to scan their um verbal interview, I think and did the interview and then literally less than five minutes later got a uh decline. And I that candidate experience then for that individual is not good, yeah. So yeah, is it right that we use that for technology AI for screening? Yes, it is, but we need to manage things like that, which is like, oh my goodness, right? Literally computer said no, you know. I didn't even get to talk to a member of that company. So it's it's it's how you how you get the balance of that.

SPEAKER_00 36:33

Yeah, agreed. And uh maybe one of my final questions, but um if you looked back at your journey within Morrisons, is there anything you would do differently, or lessons learned, or or things that you you see?

SPEAKER_02 36:48

Um gosh, anything I do differently. Um Yeah. I think I think what I do differently, I think particularly for stores, if I go to stores, this is like saying um the stores have got it all wrong. That that's not true. I think it's harder when because they're more disparate. Uh what I would have done differently is I'd have got more resource, perhaps more central resource that was managing those schemes and those individuals on a personal basis. Um I don't think and we'd we've actually done that now. And I think we're a bit late to the mark on that. Um and it's not just managing the candidates, it's actually supporting our store managers and our managers in store so that they truly understand what the scheme is. Can you imagine how many things uh a store manager has to juggle? I mean, it's it is crazy, plus a huge, huge team, and then you put a degree apprentice in the middle of that, yeah, and expect the store manager to know their scheme perfectly and exactly what they should be doing. Yeah, uh, we misjudge that, uh, and we should have had had more central people support to support support store managers to support um the colleagues on edit career schemes earlier on. But I'm really pleased to say that we do have that now.

SPEAKER_00 38:24

That's good. I said it was my final question, it's not my final question. I always like to finish the podcast with some quick fire uh questions. Okay, it doesn't have to be one word, it can be whatever comes to mind uh regarding it. I've got a list, I'll fire through them and it will catch nothing to catch you out, so whatever comes to mind. So just if it's one word, but no pressure at all. Uh so first question what uh one word that describes Morrison's early career strategy today?

SPEAKER_02 38:53

Um sustainable, um fulfilling.

unknown 38:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:00

Good. Uh second question, what's the mis uh what's the biggest misconception people have about early careers programs?

SPEAKER_02 39:07

Uh I can't do it in one word. I think it I think it's um misunderstanding the talent that young people have.

SPEAKER_00 39:15

Uh what's one thing you think all organizations should start doing in early careers?

SPEAKER_02 39:21

Uh making sure that work is valuable, truly valuable to the business uh and to that individual.

SPEAKER_00 39:31

Anything they should stop?

SPEAKER_02 39:34

Er stop treating early careers colleagues like your administrators.

SPEAKER_00 39:41

What skill do you think will matter most for graduates entering the workplace in 2026 and beyond?

SPEAKER_02 39:47

Um either way, I think it's a lot what you're saying. I think uh the world is gonna be driven around data, um technology, AI. It doesn't matter where you work, what job you're doing. So that acumen is really important.

SPEAKER_00 40:04

Good. And one final one. What's one piece of advice you'd give to your younger self when you started this journey? Um They weren't designed to be too hard.

SPEAKER_01 40:13

If it's too tricky, don't worry about it.

SPEAKER_02 40:15

I'm trying to be, I'm I'm trying to be uh authentic. Um yeah, but I I mean maybe sometimes have a little bit more patience. Um yeah, I could be a bit emotive when things are not going well for our early careers colleagues, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:34

Good, perfect, brilliant. Well, listen, Ali, thank you so much for joining me today on the podcast. It's been great talking to you, really great to understand Morrison's journey, but more importantly, your journey uh that you've had with them and previous experience as well. I hope everybody enjoyed uh listening and hope to speak to you again very much in the future.

SPEAKER_02 40:52

Okay, thank you very much.

SPEAKER_00 40:54

Thank you.